BSI Racing Warning

[Dom Bastien]

In January, at the Sebring PBOC Winterfest, I ran the BSI Racing Miata without incident. In mid-April, I asked BSI for my $4,000 deposit. I am still waiting. All I have gotten from the owner Stu Brunner are variations on the theme of "the check was mailed," with the inference that I was somehow negligent in picking up my mail or in recognizing a window envelope.

I was surprised with this complete stiff arm response. If you have a problem, hard times and such, why not deal with it honestly and try to work something out?

I spoke to two former BSI customers at the Lime Rock Skip week-end. They, and a third Skippy customer they knew, had to resort to various collection devices to get their money back.

Personally, I am lodging a complaint with the Florida consumer protection agency and I am suing BSI racing for my $4,000.

In the meantime, if you are considering racing with BSI, I strongly suggest that you speak to Skippy racers who have used BSI in the past 3 years.

[John Greist]

Haven't asked for my deposit(s) back - for Revere and me - but the cars and BSI efforts at three tracks we've run with them have been great.

Sorry the business side of the racing relationship is suffering. Hope they can clear it up as it's essential for repeat business and new SBR customers.

[Slowhands]

Dom--

You and I spoke about this at LRP. I haven't logged on to Juicy for a week or so, found this thread this morning as I settle into my home routine. I have read emails that demonstrate that unfortunately MANY customers have had this experience. The basic thrust of the apologists is that Stu is having health issues and business problems related to the economy and poor decision-making, and as a result cash flow is suffering so he is using deposits as working capital.

My response to this is as follows:

I believe Stu's use of deposits as working capital pre-dates his "business problems." I don't think he is malicious, but likely fell into the tempting trap that it was a convenient source of free capital. I wouldn't be surprised if the practice is widespread in racing, in fact I assume it is so. I do hope Skippy doesn't do it. Stu was getting away with it when times were good and margins were larger, and likely thought that he would always somehow stay ahead, the flawed reasoning that causes nearly all Ponzi-like schemes to crumble. In May 2006 (BEFORE Stu's foray into pro racing, I believe) shortly after my initial Skippy 3 day school, I signed up with BSI to run an SCCA driver's school at Homestead. I was in the process of trying different classes of cars to see which discipline of this sweet science had the biggest attraction for me. At that point I had also done a rally school and was already signed up for a Panoz 3 day in their 300 hp GT cars. A friend I had made at my ADV2 at Daytona was a Florida resident and had heard about BSI and set it up for the both of us. This was also I believe about 1 1/2 years before JP and Skippy drivers who wanted to go Miata racing started using BSI as the regular partner for arrive-and drive SCCA racing. At the time it was a completely independent foray by my friend and myself.

To make a long story short, the on-track experience was completely satisfactory. Stu's cars were well-prepped and well-powered, and handled beautifully. Even though a novice at the time, I was among the better performing cars in the school. Stu and I had interesting conversations between sessions. I thought I would do more events with Stu and therefore did not ask for my deposit back right away. Over the summer I did a few more SM events with different shops (OPM Autosport out of Atlanta and Long Road Racing out of N.C.) and decided after I wrecked a car at Turn One at Road Atlanta because of poor discipline (missed the apex on several successive laps, finally missed it by so much it bit me) that I needed much more close, corner-by-corner instruction and came back to Skip for the obvious reasons. So in November I asked for my deposit back, first by phone (twice, spoke to Stu once and Paul once) and then by letter (twice). Receiving no response to the letters except "I believe we just sent that out," I knew I had to act directly. On my way to a Skip Sebring event in Feb 2007, I landed early in the day in Orlando, got my rental car and drove first to Speedcom to get my helmet wired, and the to the BSI shop in Ormand Beach (an hour and a half round trip out of my way), walked in the shop and asked Paul for my check. He printed one out and I told them in no uncertain terms that this was not how I expected customers to be treated, and left. The interesting thing was that at the same time I was trying to get a deposit check back from OPM and was also encountering a delay in receiving that one. I therefore assumed that using deposits as working capital was business as usual. I fully expected the check to bounce but to my surprise, it did not. (OPM at least mailed me my check after the third phone call. I was very angry that I had to physically go to BSI to get that one.) At the time, no one I knew at Skippy was interested in Miata racing, plus my circle of Skippy friends was tiny (I was a "slow guy," and no one talked to me except other "slow guys"). It was not until much, much later that my speed increased to a point where anyone cared about anything I had to say. By the time many of you were running with BSI I saw JP was involved and I figured Stu would value his reputation with JP so much that he wouldn't dare damage that through business shenanigans with customers, but sadly it seems that was not true. It is a very short-sighted approach.

I came close to running a BSI event with the JP 'team" of Skippy/Juicy guys purely for the camaraderie and the allure of endurance driving, but haven't because I just plain love driving tail happy open wheel formula cars. They continue to teach me much more about driving on the limit than the Miatas did, and I like the physical demand they put on my body. I liked Stu as a person and his operation is performance-wise top notch, but such behavior abuses the trust of the customer relationship and that is not excusable. Using deposits as working capital is illegal. Period, end of story. Having said that, I am world-wise enough to recognize that racing is one of those arenas where one operates on a knife edge in terms of both business and performance, and cutting corners and shadiness have flourished in both aspects of the game since the first race team was founded. Dom, I hope you get your money back.

[WatertownNewbie]

Originally Posted by Slowhands

Using deposits as working capital is illegal. Period, end of story.

Harsha, I do not know what your contract provided, but mine included the following language:

"A damage deposit in the amount of $4000.00 must be received by BSI RACING INC. not less than two weeks prior to the event. Said deposit may be co-mingled with other BSI RACING INC. funds and may be retained by BSI RACING for future events damage deposit unless notified otherwise by driver."

Such provisions are not unusual (check the next time you make a deposit on a pre-construction house contract), and I had no expectation that the deposit would be escrowed or otherwise segregated.

[chsutherland]

I am glad you caught that Ted. I was sure it read that way, but was unsure. A few comments on here and via email, I thougt were uncalled for. Perhaps we can all check our facts before public accusations. Dom excluded, as he had a valid concern with the return of his CD$. After all financial slander can be ugly.

[Slowhands]

Originally Posted by WatertownNewbie

Harsha, I do not know what your contract provided, but mine included the following language:

"A damage deposit in the amount of $4000.00 must be received by BSI RACING INC. not less than two weeks prior to the event. Said deposit may be co-mingled with other BSI RACING INC. funds and may be retained by BSI RACING for future events damage deposit unless notified otherwise by driver."

Such provisions are not unusual (check the next time you make a deposit on a pre-construction house contract), and I had no expectation that the deposit would be escrowed or otherwise segregated.

Ted, however provisions may be made to read, in the state of NC it is ILLEGAL to commingle ANY security deposit, damage deposit, or earnest money (ie a deposit on a pre-construction house) with other corporate funds. These can ONLY be put into escrow. The law has been the same in other states in which I have resided, and I would bet that whatever the actual practices people persuade others are acceptable, the laws in the State of Florida are similar. I saw it in my BSI contract and ignored it because I wanted to go racing, but I will not again.

Originally Posted by chsutherland

I am glad you caught that Ted. I was sure it read that way, but was unsure. A few comments on here and via email, I thougt were uncalled for. Perhaps we can all check our facts before public accusations. Dom excluded, as he had a valid concern with the return of his CD$. After all financial slander can be ugly.

Craig, in that case, I too should be excluded, because I too had a valid concern with the return of my CD. Had I not arrived in person to demand my check, who knows if or when I would have gotten it. I was civil and polite throughout the whole ordeal, but no one at BSI apologized for making a guy from Kentucky travel all the way to Florida to pick up his deposit that he had asked for 4 times, 9 months after the one event he did with the company. Which either means they don't care, or its business as usual. That is my personal conclusion. I have described the facts as they happened and my honest thoughts at the time. I should not have been forced to do what I did in order that someone else make good on his obligation to me. I lived up to my end of the deal. I am sorry if Stu is having problems with his business, I certainly have compassion for his cancer and pray for everyone with cancer to achieve remission (my mother has so far survived her own battle, but it is never over) and have no desire to think ill of him, but a man's word is his bond. I told my story to provide information to my friends.

[Dom Bastien]

Well, I got the check a week ago. And it cleared. They've got a guy named Cornell who is taking care of accounting. He seems to be a good citizen. Hopefully, BSI is changing their approach to business.

[rcote]

Glad it worked out for you Dom without having to make a "personal" visit like Harsha had to.. And thanks for updating us with your results. Hopefully with Cornell "on duty" things will work better in that regard. i wish for nothing but the best for Stu personally and professionally.

Good seeing you at LR a few weeks ago too..

[WatertownNewbie]

Dom, thank you for posting this follow-up, and I too am glad that things worked out well. It is regreattable that Stu and BSI have had so many customers suffer unpleasant experiences with the return of the damage deposit (I am in that group too). The damage deposit issue is absolutely the only negative thing that I could say about Stu and BSI. Everything else in my one event was extremely positive. Top-notch mechanics, excellent cars that were very well prepared, superb service. In addition, Stu is a fine person and has more survival skills than ninety percent of the kids I teach at a private high school. I wish him the best as he struggles with health issues.

The pattern here seems to be that getting a return of the damage deposit can be a hassle (and maybe a big hassle -- bigger than it should be and certainly not what a customer service adviser would recommend as a business practice). Nonetheless, to my knowledge no one has failed to receive the deposit eventually. If I decide to do more Miata driving, more likely than not it will be with BSI.